Humanitarian OSM Team/Meetings/TrainingWG/24 November 2014
15:08:03 <BlakeGirardot> Hi
15:09:04 <clairedelune> Hello
15:09:18 <clairedelune> Who else is there for the Training WG meeting?
15:09:39 <Tallguy> Hi, here as well, but need to leave about 1545hrs to catch a train
15:09:48 <SpikeUK> Sitting on the side
15:10:36 <emirhartato> hello everyone
15:10:47 <emirhartato> I'm baaaaack! I can type again! So happy :')
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15:12:03 <althio> hi
15:12:18 <clairedelune> So, our agenda is here: https://hackpad.com/Training-WG-Meeting-November-24-2014-u6VFosnUuyb
15:12:51 * mtb is lurking for it.
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15:14:40 <clairedelune> Great!
15:15:28 <clairedelune> So, now we have a nice list of data extraction tools. How do we choose where more documentation is needed?
15:16:03 <clairedelune> What are the most strategical ones at the moment? How can we help people using them?
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15:17:56 <mtb> I have personally always used geofabrik. Not sure if it was just the first one I found....
15:18:28 <emirhartato> I have personally use geofabrik, hot-export, and recently overpass turbo
15:18:44 <emirhartato> geofabrik + hot export have well documented
15:19:30 <emirhartato> and it seems people also interested with estratti
15:19:44 <emirhartato> http://osm-toolserver-italia.wmflabs.org/estratti/en/
15:20:57 <clairedelune> I think overpass turbo might need more explanatary documentation for users in order for them to use its full potential
15:22:23 <althio> I have used overpass turbo (very lightly) since it is linked in the wiki articles for a lot of key
15:23:13 <emirhartato> haven't tried it yet, at the moment still limited for Italy only but Laura said through the mailing list, she would like to improve the tool through OPW
15:23:15 <emirhartato> I agree Claire, as the documentation from the website itself is more.... technical
15:23:44 <mtb> First time I am looking at it, it seems that the info on the OSM wiki has a lot of examples.
15:26:03 <clairedelune> Maybe creating a new page (as visible as possible) listing all tools and linking towards their documentation could be enough?
15:27:01 <clairedelune> not all documentation is in one place, and when someone not much involved into HOT or OSM tries to use a tool, he/she might not know where to look for more info
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15:28:05 <emirhartato> maybe add another column for contacting the developer so people would ask more?
15:28:16 <mtb> That makes sense. I have not heard of a lot of these. A nice link off something near to the front pae would be good.
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15:32:53 <clairedelune> Initially, the idea for this listing of OSM data extraction tools came from Mikel's request, asking for a video tutorial, which would explain step by step how to
extract data from OSM
15:33:21 <clairedelune> I heard many people were interested by this (either to make it or to watch it afterwards)
15:34:15 <clairedelune> Are there people willing to participate in creating such a video?
15:35:20 <BlakeGirardot> There would have to be one for each tool ?
15:35:28 <clairedelune> Regarding the tools' list, shall we place it on the wiki now?
15:35:54 <clairedelune> Not necessarily, I think it was just to show a few of the options available
15:36:02 <emirhartato> @Blake... not really.. @Claire, agree
15:36:34 <emirhartato> there's a column for volunteers to improve documentations, maybe we can change that for those who willing to make video tutorial
15:37:13 <emirhartato> so people can just put their name on the wiki and everyone will know
15:37:29 <clairedelune> @emirhartato: yes they could be merged I think
15:37:34 <emirhartato> to avoid overlap (people made the same thing)
15:38:13 <emirhartato> yes it's possible to merge and improve the table a bit
15:38:16 <clairedelune> but that field could include the video link when available. before that, it will be X and Y preparing/working on it
15:38:27 <clairedelune> (for instance)
15:38:38 <emirhartato> yes that could work
15:40:01 <clairedelune> ok, can we continue with point 2? (welcome letter)
15:40:50 <emirhartato> yes
15:41:17 <clairedelune> Actually I was wondering if it should really be the only one email we would be sending.
15:41:23 <emirhartato> reading the draft at the moment
15:41:39 <Tallguy> I like the idea, and the format proposed, for the letter. But translation needs to be considered - link to something central?
15:42:21 <Tallguy> I also agree that something at intervals may be an idea
15:42:31 <BlakeGirardot> Claire, I agree, we could add a link: If you would like more communition from us click here. Double opt in is really requred, signup and confirming email is double opt in.
15:42:43 <clairedelune> I agree we shouldn't spam or be too insistant, but we could maybe send 2 or 3 in a row (on different aspects of HOT OSM). And there would be a link below the message so people can unsubscribe from the first one if they don't want to get anything else
15:43:01 <BlakeGirardot> Oh, I see. 2 or 3 in a row is a great idea.
15:43:32 <clairedelune> so it wouldn't need to be too long, people would focus on one thing at a time more or less
15:45:46 <Tallguy> Sorry, I'm going to have to leave - train to catch! I like the letter format & would support its circulation
15:45:57 <clairedelune> Does anyone know how are handled the translation at the moment on the TM?
15:46:10 <clairedelune> Bye Tallguy & thanks !
15:46:44 <BlakeGirardot> bye tall guy
15:46:56 <Tallguy> Bye
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15:47:08 <clairedelune> It would be great to know the user's language preference to know which translation to send him? or were you thinking about links towards a translation on the
15:48:18 <clairedelune> And I agree with Tallguy's concern that we should think about how we will deal with translations. I guess English will serve as a base (as usual...)
15:48:30 <emirhartato> bye tallguy
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15:53:54 <clairedelune> BlakeGirardot, do you think you need more help now? I'll try to review your answers to my comments later tonight
15:54:22 <clairedelune> Thanks a lot already for that!
15:54:23 <emirhartato> I agree about using english as base and put link to translation on the top before the content
15:55:02 <BlakeGirardot> No, not really on the letter, editing feedback, did we decide on one or an edit of my proposed to start?
15:55:04 <clairedelune> emrihartato so, where should be stored the translation? on the website?
15:56:49 <clairedelune> I think we were at least 3 thinking about sending a few emails with an interval. Does anyone have an objection to this? or would you support the idea?
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15:56:50 <emirhartato> HOT website? maybe?
15:57:08 <BlakeGirardot> What interval
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15:58:17 <clairedelune> Could be a few days between first and second, then a few weeks between second and third for instance (to try to keep new contibutors learning)
15:58:30 <BlakeGirardot> Thats sounds perfect?
15:58:32 <mtb> A system that I used sent an email once a week for three weeks from sign up, with some helpful advice to get used to the new system.
15:58:52 <clairedelune> emirhartato, I guess it could even be on the TM website
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15:59:02 <mtb> So you got one immediately, saying that this was one of three e-mails that would be sent over the next few weeks.
15:59:18 <BlakeGirardot> sounds good
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15:59:37 <emirhartato> claire, sounds good
15:59:42 <clairedelune> yes I also experienced this and it was helpful
16:00:20 <mtb> In this instance, one explaining how the TM works could be sent immediately, followed a week later by one with some more advice or a JOSM tutorial followed by another one a week later with extracting data.
16:00:40 <mtb> Or however seems most useful. Just spitballing ideas right now. :)
16:00:42 <clairedelune> then there's still some work to do, choosing which info should come first and then what to send next.
16:00:45 <clairedelune> :)
16:01:07 <clairedelune> IT sounds good mtb
16:01:55 <mtb> But yeah, I think that explaining that we will send x e-mails, one a week with some helpful advice and tips to better mapping in the sign up might be a good approach.
16:02:18 <mtb> Does not swamp inboxen, but subtly gets people used to using the system.
16:02:56 <BlakeGirardot> Someone is going to say they need to be able to opt out of them don't you think?
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16:04:40 <clairedelune> that's possible but if they know they will be only 3, and they are at least slightly interested, they won't opt out I think
16:04:55 <clairedelune> though we should offer the possibility to do so if they wish
16:05:37 <BlakeGirardot> I think you are right and I don't even think it is a problem, but I know it will be an issue.
16:07:15 <clairedelune> what would be an issue? (setting up the unsubscribe link?)
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16:09:27 <BlakeGirardot> No, just that they have an option to opt out, I am pretty sure that will be brought up
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16:11:43 <althio> it is an issue: people will ask for it ; it is not a problem: technically not a big deal
16:15:26 <clairedelune> thanks althio. anything else on that subject? I'm still adding a few comments
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16:16:29 <BlakeGirardot> I'll either add or amend the issue in github that we have the text for letters, or at least place holder text
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16:16:51 <pierzen> Hi all, not much time, will react rapidly. New contributors to follow. example of a new contributor that erased a few highways including a major one. I had a request yesterday from a contributor to revert deletions. We would need ways to follow new contributors, spot such problems in particular deletions, and follow actions taken.
16:17:51 <pierzen> Github translations. The major problem since last year that you dont adress, it seems, is the Uploading of images. To do a good job you should be able to see simultaneously the text plus the translated images.
16:18:25 <clairedelune> Blake, you could share another draft, or a final version proposal when you are available. so then the translations can take place. Good point pierzen: contacting contributors serves also as a kind of helpdesk, that should be mentionned also for "mistakes"
16:18:45 <BlakeGirardot> claire, what operating system and browser do you us that kwik interface doesn't work on?
16:19:20 <clairedelune> (BlakeGirardot, let me try again so I will check which one it was)
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16:23:04 <emirhartato> sorry I need to leave. almost midnight here and I have meeting early morning tomorrow
16:23:27 <BlakeGirardot> Ok, good night emir
16:24:28 <emirhartato> thanks all
16:24:51 <clairedelune> thanks a lot emri, good night
16:25:03 <clairedelune> *emir (sorry)
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16:34:42 <clairedelune> It souds like we are over for today...?
16:35:07 <clairedelune> Do we postpone the other points on the agenda until next time?
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16:39:29 <althio> your call clairedelune ;)
16:41:00 <clairedelune> althio, I think that's what we are going to do. ;) Thank you all for participating and have a nice evening/morning/afternoon/night...!
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16:41:47 <althio> bye
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