User talk:Daniela.peter

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Project Related Terms

IMPORTANT NOTE: The project RelatedTerms is part of a larger idea to enhance search within this wiki and from other tools. User:Geonick and myself are NOT using a Bot but a synonym editor with upload functionality; it downloads/uploads Wiki pages just like JOSM is uploading data.

Your bot is buggy!

  1. Writes "Related Terms" instead of "Ähnliche Seiten" in the German namespace...
  2. It creates empty "Related Terms" entries: [1] [2] ...
  3. The links are often useless: "‹ Kloster › " on DE:Tag:historic=monastery
  4. Destroys page content: [3] [4] [5] [6] ...

I think adding generated search words is always useless. If a user wants to search for a term, it is always possible to use the search-field in the upper right corner. We only need approved useful wikilinks in the content of pages. --phobie m d 11:22, 20 September 2011 (BST)

Bot not anymore buggy (and replaced by users :->)

Dear Phobie!
Thanks for the hints, especially to the buggy beaviour you enumerate in your points 2 and 4! And thanks for reverting these for us.
  • Regarding your point 1: RelatedTerm is not german but it's a well known scientific englisch expression (see thesaurus). But we can change these entries in German pages to "Verwandte Begriffe: " instead.
  • Regarding your point 3 this needs some explanation which can be found here Template:RelatedTerm. I have announced RelatedTerms in both, english and german mailing lists.
  • These bot entries are done only once as a seed and will then be maintained by hand in the near future (for example by me :->).
  • Your point 3 suggests that they are useless. That's not the case: For example adding "Abtei (de), Kloster (de)" to the wiki page of DE:Tag:historic=monastery allows two things: 1. Kloster can be found by a usual Wiki search and 2. all related terms will be collected and hopefully made available in the near future through Taginfo (and it's open to be integrated in JOSM). The idea is that you enter "Abtei" and get hints that "historic=monastery" is probably the tag you looked for.
Geonick 01:40, 21 September 2011 (BST)
  • "Kloster" was on that page before. It is the term itself and not a related term. So searches on "Kloster" would succeed without being listed in the "Related Terms".
  • Listing "Abtei" might be useful, but it does not need to be a link to a wikisearch.
  • The " (de)" postfix is not needed in the German namespace.
  • The "." after each entry is strange and should be removed.
  • If you search for a German word, it might be useful to only search in the DE-namespace...
--phobie m d 21:21, 22 September 2011 (BST)
  • Yes, Kloster appeears on that page - but only as part of the word "Klosterbauten". In addition is Kloster currently is a redirect page. But even if 'Kloster' would appear explicitly in the wiki text, adding 'Kloster' to the related term list would make sense, because it's then explicitly part of the set of synonyms. -- Geonick 11:18, 27 September 2011 (BST)
  • Most other points you mention further can be changed in the Template. I would not remove the "." because terms would show like this: church. Lord's house (en_UK)..
  • You write that The " (de)" postfix is not needed => Good point, "de" could (and will) be inferred by tools - but only if there is a namespace on that page. Still, 1. I would not forbid users to add the de in the template in order to make it explicit. And 2. there are use cases where one want to add related terms also in other language than the current name space (term language is not always equal to page namespace).
-- Geonick 11:18, 27 September 2011 (BST)

Related terms that are not actually related to the tag

Where do your initial related terms come from? It looks as if you just add "similar" words, regardless of whether they make sense in the context of OSM tagging. For example, Tag:amenity=clock contains "alarm" as a related tag - but we don't map alarm clocks, nor are other alarms (sirens etc.) covered by the tag Tag:amenity=clock. --Tordanik 10:26, 3 October 2011 (BST)

Another example: "walk. trip. run. pace." for Tag:highway=steps. These words are not related to "step" in the meaning of "Stufe". They are related to "step" in the meaning of "Schritt" - but that's not what the page is about! You are not just copying a thesaurus to the wiki, are you? --Tordanik 10:48, 3 October 2011 (BST)
Thank you for the hints. And good idea to open a separate heading for errors like those. In fact it seems that there are some terms that have'nt been verified with the OSM tags; I'll check that --Geonick 19:46, 3 October 2011 (BST)

Visual considerations

There is another problem with your RelatedTerms: They look ugly if you just add them as text to the last paragraph. Wiki pages exist primarily to be read by humans, not parsers. So there should be some visual separation between the actual article content and the metadata. This problem can certainly be solved in different ways. Maybe just placing all the related terms in a template box together would work? (Like this?) The style of such a box could certainly be improved later - which is one of the advantages of using a template - but the aspect in general should be considered before adding even more terms. --Tordanik 11:35, 3 October 2011 (BST)

I completely agree that Wiki pages are made for humans. In fact, your proposal of a RelatedTermList looks nice so far in your example and e.g. her Tag:railway=crossing). What very important in gereral is, that this is not a Bot but an "Synonym" editor with upload functionality (just like JOSM is uploading data). --Geonick 19:52, 3 October 2011 (BST)

related term water tower addition


I saw that you appended a related term, "water tower" to the end of Tag:man_made=water_tower. Did you do this so that the search engine would find it better? There is a redirect in place already for Water tower. --Ceyockey 23:35, 3 October 2011 (BST)

Oh ... I see the thread above ... no need to address my question individually. I think a hatnote solution might work, but let me give it some thought. --Ceyockey 23:37, 3 October 2011 (BST)