Talk:Key:fhrs:id

Proposal: adding a 'How to map' section

Early into the UK Q1 2026 project to add FHRS IDs, there were some questions on the relevant forum thread about mapping guidance.

Roughly speaking, most FHRS IDs are mapped as a 1-1 mapping from either a node or a polygon (way/area) in OSM to an FHRS ID. At the time-of-writing, nodes and polygons are near-equally-popular locations to find the fhrs:id tag, according to taginfo, with around ~90k of each.

I'd like to suggest adding a "How to map" section to the Key:fhrs:id page here on the OSM wiki, to help future mappers. I've found those sections very helpful to map other entity types, such as drinking water.

A few example cases I have in mind are:

• Simple 1-1 FHRS-to-point mapping.

 * https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/1296769605

• Simple 1-1 FHRS-to-polygon mapping.

 * https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/5219528

• Multiple FHRS IDs for a single point-or-polygon - this is used in places where I think surveying in detail may have been a challenge and/or shared facilities are in use; in some cases it may be possible to refine the map further to identify single locations for each FHRS ID.

 * https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/10226495525
 * https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/4500381203
 * https://www.openstreetmap.org/way/934913783

• Single FHRS ID mapped to multiple points - for example, when a single kitchen serves food to a few nearby places:

 * Rutland Hotel, Edinburgh
   * https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2342839055
   * https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/1434403669
   * https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/2100392638

 * Teviot Student Union, Edinburgh
   * https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/1770134134
   * https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/4385880889
   * https://www.openstreetmap.org/node/4385880890

I would also plan to mention the relevance of referencing source=FHODOT in the changeset, and source:addr="FHRS Open Data" where relevant too.

Would this be helpful? Are there any more factors and/or situations to consider? Jay.addison (talk) 12:52, 29 March 2026 (UTC)

I agree it would be great to have some information about how to map the FHRS IDs, so many thanks for making a start! I think you're maybe over-complicating things a bit with the discussion of nodes vs ways, and the 1-to-1 vs 1-to-many vs many-to-one. I think the key point is that each FHRS ID should be added to the OSM object (or sometimes objects) that corresponds to the thing that has the rating. That object could be a node, or a way, or even a relation - but it doesn't matter at all for the purposes of adding the FHRS ID. (The decision on which type of OSM object to use will depend on the type of object it represents and the context around it.)

As you say, there will usually be exactly one such OSM object for each FHRS ID. But sometimes there can be more than one, sometimes there can be none, and sometimes the same object can have multiple IDs. I think the case of there being no OSM objects to add the ID to should also be mentioned. It would be good to make the point that we shouldn't map things we wouldn't normally map just to add an FHRS ID. But if a mappable object that would have an FHRS ID is missing it would good to add it. It might be possible to do this just from the FHRS data (but the FHRS location can't be taken as accurate, and the FHRS data may be out of date), other times it might need reference to other OSM-compatible sources or a require a ground survey.

I think it would also be good to describe how to identify the FHRS ID of a business (either via the FSA website or using FHODOT). I'm not sure I would ever recommend using source=FHODOT, as that's just a tool, not the underlying data that's actually the source. Rjw62 (talk) 16:13, 29 March 2026 (UTC)

Thanks!

Collecting some todo-items (probably with broken formatting for the indented items) from your response and some private feedback:

• Be straightforward about the FHRS-ID-to-object linkage.
• Describe scenarios where no suitable OSM object exists. And some basic hints:

* Is there already a building mapped with the business address and postcode?

* Do you know whether the named eatery/business is at that location?

* Would an OSM note be suitable so that someone can add it?

• Add references to historic discussion threads.
• Either here or in a related wiki page: suggest tools and workflows (e.g. FHODOT, JOSM) that can simplify mapping FHRS info.

* ...bearing in mind: corrections are often needed for address details.

* and note that postcode is required for FHODOT to consider FHRS-to-OSM linkage complete. Jay.addison (talk) 17:57, 29 March 2026 (UTC)

Oh, and one more from me: guidance about removing outdated FHRS IDs (ones where the FSA website doesn't show any results, and/or the data is not in the FHRS Open Data dataset any more) could be useful. Whether to move to an old* lifecycle prefix, or simply remove. Jay.addison (talk) 17:58, 29 March 2026 (UTC)

There's 3 scenarios regarding an outdated/invalid/missing FHRS:

1. There is a replacement with the same address. You can easily update this. The FHODOT tool will remove the invalid ids and leave the new one with the JOSM remote plugin. You then need to tick the fhrs:id row in JOSM (and adjust any others as appropriate). This is quite common when an inspection has happened with no issues/closure.
2. There is a replacement with a different address. This usually requires further checks or a ground survey as the place may have moved. Yes some businesses move next door or a few doors away.
3. There's no replacement. A ground survey is likely needed, unless there's an obvious alternative info, or another FHRS item for the same address with a newer/recent inspection date.

Smsm1 (talk) 19:38, 29 March 2026 (UTC)

Very minor, but I would vote to leave out source:addr, it's generally accepted that source tags should go on the changeset, not the object. CjMalone (talk) 14:40, 31 March 2026 (UTC)