Talk:Tag:amenity=sanitary dump station
Meaning of additional tags?
Two tags were added to the combination= field without definitions:
What do these tags mean? Does it refer to whether or not the dump station accepts greywater or toilet waste? I assume the values are yes/no?
There are also 2 tags that were included in the approved proposal, but not clearly defined:
- sanitary_dump_station:suction=yes/no
- sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes/no
Can someone provide a good definition for these? --Jeisenbe (talk) 16:08, 5 July 2019 (UTC)
Summary
The basic styles of holding tank station seem to be:
- elsan point (walk up dumping basin)(also called a CDP or CTDP)
- round drain (gravity drain hose : 3" in diameter in the USA)
- pump-out (mechanical suction).
Accepting:
- grey water (usually)
- Bilge water (rarely)
- Black water (usually)
- Black water but not grey water (occasionally)
Prohibiting:
- Certain tank chemicals
Offering at the same location:
- Rinse water which may not be potable.
- Drinking water (amenity=water_point).
- Drinking water (amenity=drinking_water).
- Walk up toilets.
Access Rules:
- From water or land, or in a few cases both.
- Free, paid in advance, pay at the pump with coins or cards, or pay at the office.
- Part of regional network or not (card key, payment card).
- Accessible to overnight guests only, or to everyone.
Position may be:
- Located on a dock next to waterway=fuel (often)
- Located on a separate dock.
- Located on land, even it only serves marine users.
- Located at each camping pitch.
- Located at a central location, with varying degrees of accessibility by large boats or motorhomes (often).
- Unknown (many RV and Marina sites list dump services on their websites, but the exact location does not appear on the brochure or map)(often).
- Associated with a walk up toilet, or not.
There are combination stations that have one or many of the above features.
Draft list of types
As tagging has progressed it becomes clear there are a few more types of dump station out there. This draft list may cover it however:
- sanitary_dump_station:pumpout=yes/no -- hoses, suction
- sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes/no -- hoses, gravity
- sanitary_dump_station:cassette=yes/no -- portable (usually wheeled) containers bring the waste to the receptacle
- sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes/no -- sink or shower water accepted
- sanitary_dump_station:chemicals_allowed=yes/no -- if there is a restriction on the sewage disposal for water based systems only.
See also http://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/29643665
Brycenesbitt (talk) 18:04, 4 April 2015 (UTC)
Warum bist du gegen
- sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes/no
wie es im Wiki waste=chemical_toilet for chemical toilets verwendet wird.
wenn ich das Wiki richtig verstehe wird auf Booten seltener giftige Chemie benutzt.
See also http://taginfo.openstreetmap.org/keys/waste#values
Dort werden
- chemical_toilet
- grey_water
und andere
fast gleich oft verwendet.
Bisher war mein Verständnis für die Keys
- sanitary_dump_station:suction=yes/no -- hoses, suction
- sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes/no -- hoses, gravity
die Technik pumpen oder ablassen und
- sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet
- sanitary_dump_station:grey_water
die Art der Entsorgung.
-- Gisbert (Gmbo) (talk) 06:02, 5 April 2015 (UTC)
--- "sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet" is not my first choice, as a common portable/temporary toilet is called a "chemical toilet". It could lead to confusion (the portable toilets are tagged toilets:disposal=chemical).
"sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet_waste" would be fine but long.
Also "excrement" is a very impolite word in the USA.
There are at least three major systems: gravity, removable cassette and suction pumpout:
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Gs613XaqGwA
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YJxcWxveJI
- https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmxTIO0BC-8
Also there is much retagging needed to get to a single scheme for toilet holding tank mapping. The "OpenSeaMap" community have their own scheme also.
Brycenesbitt (talk) 06:36, 5 April 2015 (UTC)
Try Two
How about:
- sanitary_dump_station:pumpout=yes/no -- provides a hose which removes toilet waste via suction. Often used for boats.
- sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes/no -- provides a connection for a toilet drain hose, the waste flows by gravity. Often used for RV's.
- sanitary_dump_station:cassette=yes/no -- provides a place to dump a portable (usually wheeled) toilet holding tank. Used for both marine and land users.
- sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes/no -- this is a grey water (sink waste) dump site. Tag as above also if toilet waste is allowed.
- sanitary_dump_station:chemical_restrictions=yes/no -- this site has restrictions on the types of toilet holding tank chemicals (see notes or the site's website for details).
Questions
- Why do you exchanged pumpout suction
- In my mind chemical_restrictions is not meaningful, because some countrys restrict only some chemicals. Is there using forbit , interdit or usage , allow not better?
- does gravity not include cassette?
- Gravity does NOT include cassette. See the youtube videos, those are quite different.
- Sites that restrict chemicals have different rules. Some seem to allow certain chemicals. Tagging this is too hard. But we can say "this site has some rules (defined elsewhere) about chemicals".
- I saw the second video and i mean that this is gravity dumping. But can't you give the contens of a cassette there in? Or Is it a Dumping Station with suction and not gravity?
- Sites with restricting rules take cassettes with chemicals and i would not tag this, while to difficult, but Sites who say absolutely no are the sites which i want to discribe.
- there is still the Question: Why pumpout? in openstreetmap is used only pump-out so far. Why exchange suction? Is it some gravity olso use suction?
- The table discribe some stations. Please discribe them. In my mind the first row is gravity. You can use whith hoses or you but you can give cassettes to in it. The Bayonett what i saw in 2. Video is here unusual or unused. -- Gisbert (Gmbo) (talk) 06:37, 7 April 2015 (UTC)
Examples
| Description what you see (please complete) |
La Description ce que vous voyez (Se il vous plaît compléter) |
Beschreibung was man sieht (bitte vervollständigen) |
How could it be tagged? Comment pourrait-il être légalisé(étiqueté)? Wie könnte es getaggt werden? |
image | 2. image | Videos | tagging |
|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|---|
| Traversable bottom inlet for grey water and faeces from tanks or cassettes. chemical additives are allowed. Price is included in nightly fee. |
Überfahrbarer Bodeneinlass für Grauwasser und Fäkalien aus Tanks oder Kasetten. Chemiezusätze sind erlaubt. Preis ist in Übernachtungsgebühr enthalten. |
amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes |
|
|
amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes | ||
| Traversable bottom inlet for grey water and faeces from tanks or cassettes. chemical additives are allowed. Price is included in nightly fee. In addition, a drinking water tap which has to be paid. |
Überfahrbarer Bodeneinlass für Grauwasser und Fäkalien aus Tanks oder Kasetten. Chemiezusätze sind erlaubt. Preis ist in Übernachtungsgebühr enthalten. Zusätzlich eine Trinkwasserzapfstelle gegen Bezahlung. |
amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes |
|
|
amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes | ||
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes sanitary_dump_station:pump-out=yes or sanitary_dump_station:suction=yes power_supply=yes |
|
|
[1] | amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:suction=yes sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes | |||
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes |
|
|
[2] | amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes | |||
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes |
|
|
amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes | ||||
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes |
|
|
amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes
| ||||
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes sanitary_dump_station:... |
|
|
amenity=sanitary_dump_station | ||||
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes |
|
||||||
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=yes sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes |
|
[3] | amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:gravity=yes | ||||
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes |
| ||||||
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station sanitary_dump_station:chemical_toilet=yes |
Tabelle ist noch ungenau. Übersetzung ins Englisch sollte überprüft werden. Verbot muß geeignete Übersetzung bekommen. Tabelle bitte mit weiteren Beispielen erweitern in der zur Zeit letzten Zeile wäre wohl doch cassette angebracht, da man warscheinlich nur Grauwasser ablassen kann und es erhöht einen Einlass für Kassetten gibt.
- What does "sanitary_dump_station:..." mean above? Brycenesbitt (talk) 07:02, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
- ... is a Placeholder and mean and so far like (usw.).-- Gisbert (Gmbo) (talk) 12:52, 10 April 2015 (UTC)
- What does "sanitary_dump_station:..." mean above? Brycenesbitt (talk) 07:02, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
Try Three
I find the above pictures hard to understand,
I mean that Pictures (Video olso) tell the reality. I come to a sanitary Station and see what the pickture shows. To make a film is difficult because it requires a second person. This one has the same exact statement that you usually only get to ask.
and feel now that mixing grey water and sewage tagging is not wise. It's also rare, of the 67 mapped grey water locations 64 also accept black water. How about:
| Removal Style | Video | Notes |
|---|---|---|
| sanitary_dump_station:pump-out=yes | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tmxTIO0BC-8 | Provides a hose which removes toilet waste via suction. Often used for boats. There are several styles of hoses in use worldwide. question You use changing pumpout and pump_out, but i only found pump-out by tagging harbour. |
| sanitary_dump_station:round_drain=yes | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YJxcWxveJI | Provides a connection for a round toilet drain hose, the waste flows by gravity. Often used for RV's. question Why don't wie use gravity, or want you exchange drain and gravity? |
| sanitary_dump_station:basin=yes | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1D7ziKBIxuw https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7tELRMqFZKM&noredirect=1 | Provides a place to dump a portable (usually wheeled) toilet holding tank. Used for both marine and land users,and often called cassettes. |
| Attributes | Notes |
|---|---|
| sanitary_dump_station:chemicals_restricted=yes | This site has restrictions on the type of chemicals used. Leave details in notes or via a website tag. I oppose this DE:Denn ich sah nie eine Beschreibung für eine Einschrankung von Chemikalien, denn das wäre zu kompliziert. Dafür aber ein Verbot. Einschränkung gibt es nur auf Landesebene, diese Einschränkungen werden aber nie an den Entsorgungsstationen angezeigt. en:for I never saw a description for a restriction of chemicals, because that would be too complicated. But a ban. Limitation is only at the country level, these restrictions are never displayed to the disposal stations. |
| sanitary_dump_station:rinse_water=yes | Provides water for rinsing out tanks. If drinking water is available, tag that separately using amenity=drinking_water. |
The occasional station asks for black water (sewage) only, no sink water. If so tag sanitary_dump_station:grey_water=no. If a site accepts grey water only, please use tag XXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX.
| Tagging Access | Notes |
|---|---|
| amenity=sanitary_dump_station | Access from land. |
| waterway=sanitary_dump_station | Access from water. If also available for land vehicles, use both tags. |
Brycenesbitt (talk) 06:51, 9 April 2015 (UTC)
- Comment: in the USA we DO have places which restrict, but do not ban, holding tank chemicals. Brycenesbitt (talk) 00:32, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
- Comment: if the chemical ban is at the government level, but not displayed at the site, it is not verifiable. We should not map it in OpenStreetMap. Brycenesbitt (talk) 00:32, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
- Comment: the tag name gravity seems to be confusing you. I mean "hole in the ground". Brycenesbitt (talk) 00:33, 11 April 2015 (UTC)
Why is most of the page is moved? Warum wird der größte Teil der Seite verschoben?
Was soll das jetzt wieder?
What does that again now?
Warum ein neuer Name für die Stationen?
Why a new name for the stations?
-- Gisbert (Gmbo) (talk) 08:20, 24 April 2015 (UTC)
- A wiki admin named Xxzme moved the English page and this is trying to match up the French/Russian and German versions. The admin did not like two Tag Templates on one page. Brycenesbitt (talk) 09:50, 24 April 2015 (UTC)
== Gray or grey
Both are correct in English, however "grey" is much more common in British English than "gray" is. Since we tag according to British English, gray should be avoided and tags should use grey. Joost schouppe (talk) 13:20, 18 March 2018 (UTC)