Talk:Aeroways

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Discussions from key:aeroway

I have moved the historical discussions about aeroway features from talk:key:aeroway to retain all the conversations in one place. PeterIto 07:14, 17 December 2011 (UTC)

RC Runway

I entered a runway for a radio-controlled airplane club. Mapnik and Cycle Map look okay, at close zoom levels, but look short and stubby further out. However, it is too stubby at any zoom level in Osmarender. There are another two of them that I know of in the Ogden, Utah (USA) area that I haven't yet input. Could there be some value created for RC runways and taxiways? This way if they are rendered, they will at least look better. — Val42 05:52, 16 October 2008 (UTC)

I have seen runways rendered as areas instead of ways. That would seem to allow one to control the width. I don't know enough about RC runways to know if they are properly included with this tag, however. --Liber 19:52, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

Hangars

It seems like it might be useful to have a tag for hangars, as well as terminals.--Liber 19:53, 9 January 2009 (UTC)

Airfield

For a glider landing/starting area I'd suggest to use aeroway=airfield, which means an unpaved or loosely paved area to be used and reserved for Aircraft operation. Common maps distinguish between those and regular airports, which makes sense to me.--tmeller 17:10, 15 April 2009 (UTC)

Detail tagging

Since airport diagrams indicate a runway's width, I've been tagging it using width=*. It would be nice if the renderer would honor this, though.

Also, since ele=* is supposed to be GPS-accurate elevation, while airplanes and airports use measurements designed around barometric pressure, I've been tagging the nodes at each end of a runway with aeroway:ele=*. I also tag the field elevation with aeroway:field_ele=*.

BigPeteB 20:13, 17 October 2009 (UTC)

Drop-off/Pick-up zone

Big airports have multiple areas for drop-off and pick-up, which may depend on which set of gates you're going to or which airline you're using. This would be convenient to tag since you could tell your navigation device to go to "Terminal C" or "South Terminal". But how do we represent this? aeroway=gate doesn't really fit, since that's for the airplanes, not the passengers. BigPeteB 06:04, 16 November 2009 (UTC)

Prevalence of "aeroway" as an english term

Presently, neither Wikipedia nor Wiktionary contain a record for the term 'aeroway'. Nor does Onelook.com contain a record; this resource x-refs >1000 English dictionaries. Therefore, I would suggest that this is not an appropriate term to use for the concept in the English Key-space. I don't suggest an alternative right now, as I've not given it sufficient thought. --Ceyockey 16:59, 25 November 2009 (UTC)

landing lights

I am searching for tags to all the items for navigational symbols, and for some reason, airport landing lights are listed as a rendering symbol for marine nautical maps. I have not been able to find any suitable tagging for this. Anybody who can suggest anything for me? See here for details. --Skippern 23:28, 13 September 2010 (BST)

Taxiway &Runway markings

Using the tag aeroway=holding_position for the holding position markings at Chicago O'Hare. --Nickvet419 10:29, 6 October 2010 (BST)

Water runway

I have used aeroway=water_runway. Rendering could be dotted black outline. Example near SVG/ENZV:

--Gorm 13:51, 20 October 2010 (BST)

What about small airstrips

What about small airstrips that shouldn't be given the same prominence on the map as major airports?

Airport buildings

Under open issues, there are some questions regarding airport-associated buildings. For the moment, I would suggest tagging these as 'building=yes' 'aerodrome=whatever' or even just 'building=whatever'. Where whatever could be replaced by hangar or terminal. unsigned

The accepted tag for the building=* tag is that it takes a yes/no value. In this case, building=yes and aerodrome=whatever. This way, regardless of the type of building, it will always be rendered as something. --Milliams 12:25, 12 January 2008 (UTC)

Although this has been discussed elsewhere (and some proposals were rejected), I'd like to discuss several items on this page. Buildings are one of them: I believe it is valuable to some map users to see where is tower, ARO, and maybe meteo office (hangars would be nice, but not esential) DarkoS 12:25, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

Civil, military, private

Any distinction in tagging? Ojw 21:29, 28 April 2008 (UTC)

I assume military should be military=airfield instead of using aeroway=aerodrome. We need a tag for private airfields though. RehpotsirhC 16:58, 3 April 2009 (UTC)

Bits of runway

How about adding:

'aeroway = displaced_threshold' (a bit of runway that you can roll around on but not hit from the air)
'aeroway = stopway' (bit of runway you don't use except in emergency)

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Runway#.22Sections.22_of_a_runway

Yes, its nice. In addition I'd like to note surface type (paved=concrete, grass, dust...), thresholds and designations ("05", "23"). Surface type is the most prominent aerodrome attribute that is shown on VFR maps, together with tower frequency. DarkoS 12:45, 12 September 2009 (UTC)

Missing features

I am missing following features and would like to add them to the rendered items:

Key	Value	Description
aeroway	taxipath	The Painting on apron/taxiway where planes are to drive over. Each taxipath has an individual Code.
aeroway	parking_position	Area / Position where a plane is standing to board and unboard. Each position has an individual Number
aeroway	jet_bridge	The jet_bridge for passengers to board a plane without stepping outside and riding by bus.
aeroway	aeroservice	ServiceWays (Paintings on the apron) only where service-vehicles are allowed to drive from terminal to the parking-positions.

Aeroway=airport?

I've seen aeroway=airport in use in a number of locations, and (importantly) they are rendered differently. On the Mapnik layer, they are shown with a filled icon, vs. an outlined icon for aeroway=aerodrome. On the Osmarender layer, aeroway=aerodrome shows no icon at all. The rendering and the data agree that there is a difference, so we should look at defining a difference. I suggest that locations with regular passenger service (scheduled or charter) are tagged aeroway=airport, since for very many people this will be an important distinction. Chriscf 09:52, 14 November 2008 (UTC)

Here is important distinction between airport, aerodrome and airfield, probably defined by ICAO. This distinction is usually propagated into local air safety laws. E. g., airport has air traffic control, maybe customs, and a lot of different services that could operate 24 h/day.

Airfield could be just a piece of lawn. So, difference is huge. DarkoS

Small airstrips?

A few points of relevance here, these facts relate to the UK, I'm uncertain off hand about the situation in other countries: The term "Airport" has specific meaning in law, that there are customs facilities and international flights may arrive and depart there. This does not have anything to do with the physical size of the areodrome, Cambridge is an Airport for example. The term Aerodrome is the most generic term for an aircraft landing site, including a place where seaplanes land. Airfield means an aerodrome on land, all training flights and most commercial services must take place from a licensed aerodrome, and international flights must land first at an Airport, before possibly completing their flight to another areodrome. There are also studies such as GASAR (see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/General_aviation_in_the_United_Kingdom#GASAR_aerodrome_classification) which provide classification which may be of use here. In the UK at least, many military airfields are available for public use and almost all will provide air traffic services for civilian flights.

Proposed Tagging Scheme

In view of the need for a scheme which is easily used from a survey, while wishing to avoid anomolies by comparison to official classifications, I propose the following, which should be rendered with decreasing prominance:

aerodrome=* - An area feature defining the perimeter of any location where aircraft take off and land.
aerodrome=airport -Any aerodrome where customs facilities exist and/or where international flights arrive and depart. In the UK I think these would always be civillian, but in the event that a military airfield is also an airport (like Stuttgart perhaps?) then it should also be tagged military=airfield.
aerodrome=commercial - An aerodrome which is not an Airport but where commercial scheduled flights operate, such as Penzance.
aerodrome=public - An aerodrome which is open to the public for GA flights but which does not normally operare air transport flights, such as Duxford.
military=airfield - A military aerodrome, I would prefer military=aerodrome, but since I suspect that there are few military aerodromes on water and there are probably a lot of tags already out there the distinction is probably not worth worrying about. In the case where a military airfield is open for public use (such as Fairford) it should also be tagged aerodrome=* and in cases where there are separate areas for civillian and military use (Athens?) separate perimiters could be mapped, presumably joined by a relation?

aerodrome=private - Private landing sites such as farm strips. Even in the case of a single helipad I suggest that an aerodrome should be identified, there always needs to be open space in which to make an approach, and there is almost always a separate parking area. In the cases where there really is nothing other than the landing pad (such as a roof top helipad) the aerodrome way could indicate that part of the building roof where helicopters can land, which may not be the entire roof area.

-- unsigned

I Agree. We Definitely Need The Ability To Differentiate been Major Airports, Minor Airports, and Tiny Airfields.

In the area around Burlington, VT, where I do most of my mapping, there are numerous very small airfields. Most of them are probably just grass runways, as this is a relatively rural area. All of these airfields are tagged as aeroway=aerodrome because there is no other option, (also they were created by an import). The result is that on the Mapnik layer at zoom 15 there are many aerodromes rendered very prominently, and the one major aerodrome, Burlington International Airport, doesn't get rendered (due to conficts with other features I imagine). Ironic. I'm thinking for now I will just tag these little airfields as aeroway=airfield. Then they won't render at all, but at least they won't clutter the map.

I think the proposal above (who does it belong to?) is a good start, but commercial, public, and private don't really suggest importance to me. For public/private perhaps access=yes and access=no could be used?

According to this Wikipedia article in the UK aerodromes are broken down into six categories from large to small: Regional Airports, Major Airports, Developed Airfields, Basic Airfields, Developed Airstrips, and Basic Airstrips. I don't think OSM needs quite this level of detail, but how about aerodrome=airport, aerodrome=airfield, and aerodrome=airstrip. Airport renders at a high zoom level, Airfield at a bit lower, and Airstrips only at a very low zoom level. In my area there are also nodes tagged as aeroway=aerodrome in the middle of a lake. Clearly these are for seaplanes, and it doesn't seem right to call this type of aerodrome an airfield or an airstrip since there is no field or strip. Some google searching has turned up several references to a "water aerodrome" so how about aerodrome=water for these? I'd say they should render at the same low zoom level as an Airstrip. Of course there could be some huge seaplane bases that I don't know about...

-- Ezekielf 20:26, 12 June 2010 (UTC)

I strongly agree that something needs to be done about this. I'm mapping in Upstate New York and the map is totally cluttered with hundreds of tiny landing strips, a lot of them probably no longer even existing, according to the aerial imagery. I'm no expert on airports, so I'm not sure what the best solution is, but let's please implement something.Hobbesvsboyle 15:22, 4 June 2011 (BST)

Airport Traffic

Some aerodromes do not permit some types of traffic (Bourne does not normally accept helicopters, Gransden operates only gliders), and sites where skydiving routinely takes place are usually identified on aviation charts. I think these should be tagged as rotorcraft=prohibited etc. using the tags aeroplane, rotorcraft, glider, balloon, parachute, hanglider, microlight with values designated (main or only use of aerodrome), permitted, prohibited --Bskingle 11:40, 14 April 2008

That should probably follow the conventions for defining exceptions to the rule established by an access=* tag. Specifically, instead of "permitted" or "prohibited" it would be "yes" or "no". So an airfield that only allows gliders would probably be aircraft=no, glider=yes (but not access=no, because that would mean land- and sea-based access is prohibited too). On the other hand, an airfield that generally allows all types of aircraft but with one notable prohibition (such as, no balloons) would simply be balloon=no. Vid the Kid 07:27, 24 July 2009 (UTC)

Merge

It has been proposed that this page be merged into key:aeroway. Is that something that we should do? PeterIto 16:24, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Personally I would suggest that is is moved to 'Aeroway' and become an summary article for all flight related tagging, in the same way we have one for Aerialway, Buses and Railways. Some of these articles are new and un-developed, but the idea is that there is a 'main' article for each identified public transport mode. Possibly aeroway is not the right name either, but I suggest it should be a summary article and not relate to a single key or only to airports. PeterIto 16:28, 16 August 2009 (UTC)

Agreed, added the cleanup tag. Aeroway should follow a similar style to Railway in my opinion, possibly with a similar link to Airport drawing parallels to Railway stations? Martin Renvoize 12:12, 11 December 2009 (UTC)

I have done a lot of cleanup on the article now. Should we do the move to aeroway? any objections? PeterIto 10:02, 15 December 2011 (UTC)

I have now completed the merge with aeroways. Airports is now a redirect to aeroways. PeterIto 06:53, 16 December 2011 (UTC)

Aerodromes as nodes, relations and boundaries

I have been spending some time looking at how airports are coded in OSM, have been cleaning the relevant wiki articles to make the options and current practice clearer. I do also however have a few particular suggestions about how we could make it work better:

I suggest we recommend the use of a node for the main airport feature (using aeroway=aerodrome) because this allows people to position the node in the most appropriate location within the facility, which may not be in the middle which is where it ends up if an area is used. I would suggest that the node should normally be positioned close to the main terminal which is where it is of most use to passengers when trying to access the airport. I note that a number of major airports have aeroway=aerodrome nodes as well as aeroway=aerodrome boundaries which seems to imply that others also feel a need to use a node for the airport data.
It seems appropriate to combine all the elements associated with an airport into a relation:site. I have created a site relation for Oxford Airport and rather boldly also for San Francisco International airport. I have used 'roles' of runway/ taxiway/ terminal/ aerodrome/ boundary/ hangar/ access/ gate etc. For complex airports with multiple terminals it may be appropriate to create a 'site' relation for each terminal and then combine these terminal sites into a larger site for the whole airport.
There are potentially at least two different boundaries (airside, and all facilities including any associated far-flung parking, train stations etc). I have experimented with using aeroway=boundary for simple boundaries and more complex boundaries should probably be formed using relation:multipolygon. I would suggest that these boundaries are tagged with aeroway=boundary, and optionally also with a 'boundary=airside' or whatever and are included within the main airport relation with a role of 'boundary'.

Any thoughts?

-- PeterIto 22:42, 14 December 2011 (UTC)

Balloons "airports"?

Is there any tag for a balloon landing area? something like aeroway=balloonspad ? unsigned User:Xan.

Not seen anything like that in OSM yet, but you are free to get creative on this. Do however check out taginfo for aeroway to see if anyone is using something already. Actually... there is one 'aeroway=balloonpad' there (not balloonspad btw). There are also a few 'paraglider_takeoff_spot', 'paragliding_landing_site' and a 'launch pad' whatever that is for, possibly for space rockets? Looks as though it would be good to add some of this to the key table for aeroway in due course. PeterIto

Also 'leisure=balloon_launch'.[1] PeterIto 21:51, 3 January 2012 (UTC)

Thanks, I use aeroway=balloon_launch, because I really think it's aeroway tag not leisure tag. But thanks, this serves me as inspiration. See that