User talk:Tigerfell

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This is the talk page for discussing improvements to the User:Tigerfell page and its related topics.
Hier befindet sich die Diskussionsseite der Seite User:Tigerfell und verwandter Themen.

Sticky table headers CSS rules

Hi Tigerfell,

Could you add a couple of CSS rules to enable sticky table headers? Rationale and more info here. Thank you! Dl3200 (talk) 19:39, 25 October 2020 (UTC)

Page move FR:Frontage road

Hello, Thank you for the report. I wished I could fix it, but someone already did. --Dlareg (talk) 15:30, 5 September 2018 (UTC)

title parser

  • hi, it seems GCF is not a valid language code, and what's more, there are only two pages in it. Could you check in wikipedia if that's the right one? What language is it for?
  • WRT the other titles - you may want to include "title=xxxx" in the expected values when the input string is not a key or a tag. I will implement it soon thereafter.
  • POI - is there a list of such pseudo-namespaces somewhere?

Thx! --Yurik (talk) 20:07, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

I was going to link you to the list, but I wanted to add the tests first. By pseudonamespaces I refer to all the prefixes that decode languages, but are not namespaces in this wiki. So, "POI:" is not a "pseudonamespace". You could just try Special:PrefixIndex. Some people started their pages with "Countryname:" or "Countryname<space>" (page naming convention), but I would not try to infer a language from that (e.g. in Canada).
I would not really know what to use "title" for, but I guess it could be useful later. --Tigerfell This user is member of the wiki team of OSM (Let's talk) 20:20, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
The list does not include all languages. There seem to be even more languages at the documentation of Template:Languagename. --Tigerfell This user is member of the wiki team of OSM (Let's talk) 20:54, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
@Tigerfell: I do not need the languages - mw has a list of those built-in. I need non-language prefixes, like POI, Key, etc. --Yurik (talk) 21:34, 30 September 2018 (UTC)
I know, but some (like "Gcf") are different. There is no list of non-language prefixes, because those are not documented. I mean every user can create a page "Xx:Page name" and you will not know if it is a language prefix. I am afraid that you will either have to make guesses (every name with two letters followed by a colon or a dash is a language name) or work with a whitelist (e.g. every language not detected by a special list and mw is not a pseudo-namespace). That is the problem!
If you use the whitelist approach, you have the advantage that there is a list and almost everything else is not a pseudo-namespace. If you really want to find that out, I guess you would have to analyse the wiki dump (not available any more since 2015 unfortunately). --Tigerfell This user is member of the wiki team of OSM (Let's talk) 21:53, 30 September 2018 (UTC)

Double redirects

Hello Tigerfell. I've noticed that you're sending the same standard message about double redirects to different wiki maintainers. If this is a bot, it may be interesting to propose an automatic fix or a wizard to facilitate this task, I wouldn't expect any double redirect to be intentional. --Fernando Trebien (talk) 19:30, 13 November 2018 (UTC)

No, this is not a bot, but indeed I recycle the texts, because it is the same issue. All my bot edits are executed from User:TigerfellBot and they are listed on this user's page as well.
In your cases, I was not really sure if those pages were all about the same area, so I did not want to change them myself.
There is actually a server setting that could be used (see MediaWiki documentation). It is currently switched off, I guess. The manual says that it is affected by page move vandalism. However, in this wiki, only autoconfirmed users can move pages. Actually, we could suggest to switch that on. What do you think? --Tigerfell This user is member of the wiki team of OSM (Let's talk) 21:53, 14 November 2018 (UTC)
Yes check.svg Double redirects are resolved automatically now Blacktocat.svg openstreetmap/chef/pull/202#issue-231812368

Archiving proposals

Hello Tigerfell, when I archive a proposal, I generally leave the Proposal Page template in place, as it gives a quick overview what the proposal was about and how it ended (abandoned, approved, rejected etc.). It also inserts the page into categories such as Category:Proposals with "Approved" status automatically. This would be an example: Proposed features/Number of steps. I've noticed that you prefer to also replace the template when archiving, so maybe we can discuss this and arrive at a consensus? --Tordanik 14:19, 18 November 2018 (UTC)

This sounds very reasonable to me. I actually never really thought about it this way. However, I thought that we archive accepted or at least proposals in use only, so an archived proposal implies either successful voting or no one speaking up against. Is that correct?
In addition, the last proposal I archived ( did not use this template. I thought this was due to its age (first page version in 2008), but yours is from the same year. Does it mean there was no voting and it is not approved? --Tigerfell This user is member of the wiki team of OSM (Let's talk) 18:37, 18 November 2018 (UTC)
I added the template to all pages I archived... --Tigerfell This user is member of the wiki team of OSM (Let's talk) 11:44, 21 November 2018 (UTC)
Thank you, and sorry for the late reply! To answer your thoughts, I don't think there's anything per se preventing us from archiving unsuccessful proposals. As the goal of archiving is mainly to direct users to the most recent version of the documentation, though, it's certainly more useful for approved and de-facto-established propoals.
The reason why the segmented tag proposal does not have the template is probably the same as the reason it uses a non-standard page name: Because it's a relation. Back in 2008, relations were a new concept and people wrote these Relations/Proposed/* pages trying to come up with uses for them. (Given that you have since done some cleanup to relation-related pages, you've probably already discovered that peculiarity yourself, though. :)) I see no indication that the segmented tag proposal was approved, and it's in fact barely used with only 79 instances in the DB.
--Tordanik 18:37, 17 December 2018 (UTC)

Syntax für mehrere Symbole in einer Zeile

Weiss nicht, ob das hier die richtige Stelle für Fragen ist,... Ich möchte die drei Symbole Hospital-14.svg / Doctors-14.svg / Healthcare-14.svg auf der Artikelseite healthcare=* gerne in einer Zeile stehen sehen. Zur Zeit lautet die Zeile im Quelltexteditor so: "|osmcarto-rendering=Hospital-14.svg;Doctors-14.svg;Healthcare-14.svg" In der Darstellung auf dem Artikel sind dann störende Zeichen " ... " zu sehen. Hast Du einen Tipp, wie man das schöner schreiben kann, also damit die Zeichen " ... " auf der Artikelseite nicht zu sehen sind? Auch hier wird jetzt nicht alles so dargestellt, wie ich das möchte. Daher bitte schaue zunächst hier mal in den Quelltext, damit Du vielleicht besser verstehst, was ich damit meine. Gibt es irgendwo so eine Hilfsseite für die Syntax? Ggf. könntest Du mir dort gleich mal das für diesen Fall passende Beispiel heraussuchen :-). Merci vielmals im Voraus.--MalgiK (talk) 14:23, 2 March 2019 (UTC)

Hier ist die Seite für Fragen und öffentliche Mitteilungen an mich :-).
Das Problem ist, dass das eine Vorlage ist, die hier die Angabe von genau einem Bild erwartet. D.h. die Angabe von osmcarto-rendering wird schon in zwei eckige Klammern eingeschlossen, sodass man nur noch File:Example.jpg schreiben müsste. Das funktioniert aber nicht mit mehreren Bildern (habe es gerade probiert). Um das ganze noch komplizierter zu machen, ist diese Vorlage auch noch mit der Tagging-Datenbank ("Data items" genannt) verknüpft. Auch dort ist nur das Eintragen von einem Bild vorgesehen (wenn auf der Wiki-Seite keine Angaben stehen und die Vorlage nur mit der Angabe key=healthcare verwendet wird, werden die restlichen Infos aus der Datenbank ergänzt, jedenfalls theoretisch, das wird gerade erst eingeführt).
Eine Dokumentation der Vorlage findet sich auf Template:KeyDescription/doc. Die Erklärung zu osmcarto-rendering werde ich gleich ergänzen. Ich schlage vor, dass du auf der Seite Template talk:ValueDescription (ähnliche Vorlage mit vielen aktuellen Diskussionen) vorschlägst, für diesen speziellen Fall mehrere Bilder sowohl in der Vorlage als auch in der Datenbank zuzulassen. Das wäre dann auf englisch und zur Not müsste man den Initiator Benutzer Yurik mit {{Ping|Benutzername}} darauf aufmerksam machen. 10:52, 4 March 2019 (UTC)

File:OpenStreetMap Wiki MainPage.png

Hi, es ist bestimmt vorteilhaft sich vor dem Snippen auszuloggen ;) Gruß aus Mainz --Reneman (talk) 16:49, 18 March 2019 (UTC)

Darüber habe ich nach dem Hochladen auch nachgedacht, aber nichts Privates auf dem Bild gefunden. Dass bei mir die Benutzeroberfläche auf Englisch ist, hatte ich schon mal auf Talk:Wiki geschrieben und dass die englische Hauptseite nicht auf meiner Beobachtungsliste steht, hätte man sich auch denken können (ist ja schließlich geschützt). 22:08, 18 March 2019 (UTC)
Hinzu kommt, dass diverse Links/Buttons sichtbar sind, die nur für angemeldete Nutzer vorhanden sind (upload, Favoritenstern, Meldungen, Mitteilungen, Watchlist, Username, ...). Es steht jedoch weder in der Dateibeschreibung noch da wo diese eingebunden ist, dass man angemeldet ist, um den Startbildschirm so wie im Screenshot abgebildet zu sehen. Widersprüche können besonders neue und unerfahrene Besucher verwirren. ;) --Reneman (talk) 17:37, 19 March 2019 (UTC)
Aha, neue Version hochgeladen. Ich habe nichts gegen einen RevDel einzuwenden. 17:53, 19 March 2019 (UTC)
Perfekt. Yes check.svg --Reneman (talk) 19:13, 19 March 2019 (UTC)

New translation - Hu:Wiki Translation


I saw you fixed the header, thank you.

Sorry, if I made disturbances, but I could not find out how to create a new page, I just clicked as it was suggested for translation. Maybe it was a wrong page where I clicked, creating a wrong redirection. I still do not know how to do it properly, the page "Wiki Translation" is confusing for me.

Anyway why does this system not show the links to the "StreetComplete" page in other languages on the left side (like Wikipedia)? Maybe I could figure out how to start the page more easily seeing other examples.

Where can I see my contributions to "StreetComplete" app? --Misibacsi (talk) 14:46, 8 April 2019 (UTC)

When you want to create a translation for an existing English wiki page, you go to the English version and click on "Other languages" below the list of languages. Then you will see a list of the most common languages that are available in the language bar. Lastly, you click on the language name for the language in which you want to translate the content, in your case "magyar". If the link is coloured red, then the translation does not exist yet and clicking on it will create a new page with the correct name. Lastly, you can partially translate the page title by moving the page to the Hungarian title, but do not forget to keep the prefix Hu: and to add the English page name to the language template like {{language|English title}} instead of just {{language}} on the Hungarian page.
I think Hu:Böngészés is a good example. The English version is located at Browsing and there is a redirection from the English page title with the Hungarian language prefix Hu:Browsing which was created by moving the page to its Hungarian title.

Anyway why does this system not show the links to the "StreetComplete" page in other languages on the left side (like Wikipedia)?

Wikipedia uses a database to provide the links like w:wikidata:Q20010301 for all language versions of w:Help:Content translation. We use a template which checks the existence of pages with a specific page name.
You can see your contributions to the wiki page at Special:History/Hu:StreetComplete. --08:05, 9 April 2019 (UTC)

You’ve been accused of sockpuppetry by Nakaner

Yikes! Tigerfell, on the deletion policy, you’ve shockingly been accused of sockpuppetry by Nakaner, who appears to’ve pretty heavily scrutinized you and your history. Just thought I’d let you know. — EzekielT (talk) 23:44, 19 April 2019 (UTC)

Thank you for the notification. I will try to figure out the issue via private messaging. -- 09:34, 20 April 2019 (UTC)
@Tigerfell:: How’d that go :)? Also, I’ve done the post-voting cleanup... and about that... you’re not going to like this... it was rejected... with 6 yes, 15 no, and 9 abstain... — EzekielT (talk) 04:52, 28 April 2019 (UTC)
I asked him to explain to me which rule I have broken. He did not reply until now (for two weeks), so I doubt he ever will. --19:48, 5 May 2019 (UTC)
I guess he was mad because I criticised him in the German forum some months ago and there was my question(de) about his potential conflict of interest. He does not like to be criticised at all, but I am just guessing what made him think that. --20:31, 5 May 2019 (UTC)

Archiving Past Events

As someone who organises a monthly event I find the changes to the archive history & process un-nerving. Where is the history of 2019 events now. For 10 years or so we have always built the archive on a year-by-year basis. I realise you have made some surveys about wiki archiving, but on the whole it is not a topic which particularly interests me. I DO CARE when a workflow I, and many others, have been using for a long time is changed in ways I don't understand. The calendar pages are primary pieces of information edited by many people who don't regularly use the wiki. overtime there has been a tendency for over-wikification of these pages so that adding or moving data becomes increasingly complex. If size of the archive pages is an issue I suggest they be split into quarterly units. A bit of explanatory text in the templates might help as well. SK53 (talk) 12:17, 19 June 2019 (UTC)

Hi SK53,
I moved the events before 10 June 2019 to Past events 2019, because the layout was changed and I thought it was a good point in time to move the past to the 2019 page and split the page history at that point. That was my side. I guess the rest is referring to the change in the templates of the calendar, which I just commented irregularly. You can find the discussion on Template talk:Calendar#Streamlining templates. If I remember correctly, the initial motivation was increasing usability, but you should talk to @Minh Nguyen:.
I will add an explanation on top of Template:PastEvents. --16:23, 19 June 2019 (UTC)

Where is the image?

Hi, you have changed the page emergency=fire extinguisher yesterday. It seems that you have changed the image. But I cannot see any image=something.jpg in the page source code. Yet some image is displayed. Where does it come from? Thanks for explanation. Chrabroš (talk) 06:35, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

The image comes from the emergency=fire_extinguisher (Q6975) data item, which the grey pencil link by the description will take you to. It is possible to fill all of the arguments to the {{KeyDescription}} or {{ValueDescription}} templates that way, for instance ref:seedcode=*. --Andrew (talk) 06:59, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
OK. Thanks. But this raises another question: Where does this link from emergency=fire extinguisher to emergency=fire_extinguisher (Q6975) come from? How this page knows that it should use this data item? Chrabroš (talk) 07:52, 17 July 2019 (UTC)
Hi, it was created automatically when Data items where introduced (Data items#Item Creation Process). The template knows it because it asks for the data item linked to that page which is Item:Q6975. You can retrieve this information from the page information [1] or from Property:P31. I guess it internally uses the Lua function getEntityIdForTitle in Module:DescriptionFromDataItem. -- 08:40, 17 July 2019 (UTC)

Parentheses(round brackets) in OSM values allowed or not ?

I also asked at Warin61, if parentheses are allowed or not in OSM values ... IF they are allowed, then it could make 'things' easier ... —Preceding unsigned comment added by Henke54 (talkcontribs) 12:01, 30 August 2019‎

Parentheses might be impractical as they might interfere with Regular expressions (Wikipedia), but that should not stop you to propose this tag. I can not see that it is explicitly forbidden or discouraged. I currently struggle to understand the meaning of landuse=dune(s). The concept of mapping two things with one tag is rather unusual. I suggest you create a proposal and follow the standard procedure for proposals. --14:14, 30 August 2019 (UTC)

where do you seelanduse=dune(s)? ... Maybe you meantlandform=dune(s)? ... If parentheses are allowed, then i am willing to 'full'-document landform=dune(s) and propose it --Henke54 (talk) 15:12, 30 August 2019 (UTC)

Yes, that is what I meant. Well, if you first document it and then write the proposal, you will make yourself unhappy, because other users might interpret your approach as if you would try to document something that is not used. A lot of people disapprove such behaviour, because they fear that you might want to circumvent community consensus. Then you will end up in page deletion discussions. Proposing this first, gives you the option to include advise from the mailing lists and to peacefully distance yourself from the proposal if you realise that there is not enough support.
I do not understand why you again bring up the point if something is allowed or not. Editing Standards and Conventions and Good practice apply to most proposals and practices. I know most of these pages and the pages they link to vaguely and I can tell you that I do not know of any convention that tells you not to use parentheses explicitly. Please note that they are conventions only (definition of convention (meaning 1d), not to be confused with a 'law' or 'rule'), you can always propose something different, for instance opening_hours=* make use of semicolons and Good practice can be interpreted as not to use them on a big scale. You will find out if someone thinks your proposal breaks a convention during the consultations of the proposal process. --17:29, 30 August 2019 (UTC)

Hallo Tigerfell,

ich möchte für unseren Stammtisch ein Logo erstellen. Kannst du mir einen Tipp oder Hinweis geben wie man dies am besten macht/vorgeht?^--Plennert (talk) 10:50, 8 October 2019 (UTC)

Hallo, wenn ihr keine konkrete Vorstellung von einem Logo habt, könntet ihr euch von den Logos anderer Gruppen inspirieren lassen. Auf der Wikiseite Logos gibt es viele Logos von OSM und Veranstaltungen. Evtl. muss man das Copyright beachten. Ein Klassiker ist die Veränderung des OSM-Logos (SVG). Das funktioniert z. B. mit dem Programm Inkscape ( für Vektor- oder GIMP ( für Rastergrafiken. --19:40, 9 October 2019 (UTC)


Thanks for your pointers. If you have time, you could check the Glossary entries I've been adding in an attempt to make OSM friendlier to new faces. Your feedback would be welcome. eteb3 (talk) 11:07, 20 October 2019 (UTC)

Great, I changed a minor thing regarding the talk page addresses. --Tigerfell This user is member of the wiki team of OSM (Let's talk) 06:14, 21 October 2019 (UTC)

Super thanks. See here Talk:Glossary#Internal_links too, if you have time. eteb3 (talk) 07:26, 21 October 2019 (UTC)

Sorry if this isn't for you, Tigerfell: is there any way to change my username in the wiki from Eteb3 to eteb3? The latter is what I am on the map, and it was an accident of prefill that I wound up with Eteb3 here. eteb3 (talk) 18:50, 26 October 2019 (UTC)

In this special case, the answer is no, because the MediaWiki system capitalises the first letter. If I link to user:eteb3 it will automatically change to User:Eteb3. 09:43, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

Ah, too bad. Thanks. eteb3 (talk) 13:29, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

Templates for mini map display

Hi Tigerfell, I've been looking for a list of templates in use on the wiki, and referred to wikimedia as you suggested here. I can't see how to find these for OSM? What I'm looking for (but feel free to just refer me to where I can find the answer) is a template for a mini-map to indicate the location of a node, as in the final column of the table here - to save you opening the map to see where it is. Is there such a thing? eteb3 (talk) 18:59, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

PS and you'll see I'm coming to you a lot now for help as you were helpful once! Is there a better place to get help on the wiki generally? eg, I have a licence question on downstream use.eteb3 (talk) 19:08, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

You can find the templates at The link to the list of most special pages is in the left hand column, second link from the bottom. Wiki:Maps is supposed to give an answer. Is that helpful for you? There is for general questions about OpenStreetMap and there are Talk:Wiki and the Wiki Team forum specifically for OSM-wiki issues. If you have a general licensing question for Creative Commons licensing, Wikipedia's help desk might be able to help. 19:51, 27 October 2019 (UTC)

Made you a wiki administrator

Regarding Talk:Wiki#Wiki Adminship for Tigerfell, I've just made you a wiki administrator. Maybe we should have some sort of welcome message and a backchannel to discuss wiki admin issues... but we don't. Welcome to the admin team!

-- Harry Wood (talk) 21:53, 30 October 2019 (UTC)

Thank you! 22:32, 30 October 2019 (UTC)

Beschreibungen bei taginfo

Hi Tigerfell, ich vermute durch das Entfernen der Beschreibung (Beispiel: shop=convenience) auf einer Artikelseite (nicht im Datenobjekt) verliert taginfo diese Information und es entsteht dann dort im Beispiel shop=convenience eine Lücke. Magst Du das wieder rückgängig machen, oder mal bei taginfo anfragen, ob sie stattdessen die Beschreibung aus dem Datenobjekt lesen wollen, oder gibt es noch eine andere Lösung? Schöne Grüsse--MalgiK (talk) 16:46, 26 November 2019 (UTC)

Ja, Taginfo kann Wikibase/Data items nicht nutzen. Ich nehme mal an, dass mir das damals nicht klar war. Es gibt eine entsprechende Anfrage beim Taginfo-Team (Blacktocat.svg taginfo/taginfo/issues/248), die aber bisher auf wenig Gegenliebe stieß. --20:21, 26 November 2019 (UTC)
OK, danke für die Bestätigung. Kein Problem, lässt sich ja wieder alles ändern. Danke auch für den Verweis zur Anfrage 248. Störrt mich nicht, wenn taginfo beim alten System bleibt und nicht mit den Wikibase/Data items zusammenarbeitet...--MalgiK (talk) 21:41, 27 November 2019 (UTC)


Hi, please check exactly what User:Adamant1 is doing in the wiki. He's mostly just nagging around and holding things up instead of triggering constructive things. His motivation is irrelevant to me, but the outcome reminds of sabotage (see User:Rtfm). Regarding for example shop=rental or shop=car. Just making the mess worse, not even describing the "as-is" situation. rtfm Rtfm (talk) 17:29, 23 January 2020 (UTC)

Rtfm I'm not sure how or where I've done anything your accusing me of, but you have a long history of deflecting and blaming others when there's a problem instead of discussing things or taking responsibility for your actions. So it's not surprising you would do the same thing here. Unnecessary things like this tend to happen when you ignore feedback and blow all criticism off as coming from sabotaging spoon eating know-it-alls . I hope at some point you realize your behavior is the issue and not everyone else. I'm not the only one you've repeatedly had problems with. Your attitude here and the way you've acted about it is exactly why. In this particular case, it's 100% within the standards of the wiki to state the usage history of a tag. You still had multiple opportunities to point out what was incorrect if anything I wrote was so I could fix it though. But deleting everything I wrote, with the excuse that it's my opinion, and calling my attempts to resolve it in a civil way nagging etc isn't the proper way to deal with things. So the issue is 100% on you. If you had of handled it the appropriate way I would have changed what you took issue with and the article probably wouldn't be locked right now. Discussion is at the basis of this platform and in no way is it "holding things up." It's pretty obvious why you went the route of attacking me here instead of discussing it. You know you don't have any ground to stand on. You 100% did an undisclosed mass-edited of the rental tag(along with other tags), edit warred a DWG member, and that it can mentioned in the articles related to the tags you screwed with. The best thing to do would be to stop deflecting, own up to your behavior, and do things in a more rule based community friendly way from now on. I'm sure everyone would love to see it. --Adamant1 (talk) 02:30, 25 January 2020 (UTC)
Since the shop=rental article was unlocked I clarified things and added more supporting details about the history of the namespace tagging scheme. Hopefully that is OK and resolves Rtfm's claim that the edit warring was justified because my edit was "opinion." If he has any other complaints (and I'm certain he will have more) he is free to contact me on the discussion page of whatever article it is, write a message about it on my personal talk page, or even respond to relevant messages on his profile. All of those options have a much better of chance of resolving things then edit warring or personal attacks do. --Adamant1 (talk) 00:46, 27 January 2020 (UTC)

Edit warring on shop=motorcycle article

Hi. RTFM keeps edit warring me on the shop=motorcycle article like he was doing with the other article and is trying to remove references on it to well established de facto tags like clothes=* and others. Along with repeatedly deleting any mentions of alternatives to his "tagging scheme." I've tried to discuss it with him, but like the other time where he did the same thing he is throwing out insults and refusing to discuss it. Any chance you could lock the article how it is with my edits like you did before so that he will stop doing the edit warring? It seemed to help last time. --Adamant1 (talk) 07:15, 3 March 2020 (UTC)

Further issues with RTFM

So, two more examples of the same crap are [[Motorcyle tag overview] and shop=scooter. With the Motorcyle tag overview article me and two other editors (including Jeisenbe who is more then knowledgeable about this) requested that he rewrite the article to be more neutral and clearer about what tags can be used with motorcycle stuff. Instead of dealing with it though, he just insulted me by calling me an attention seeking troll in the discussion page, deleted other people discussion comments (which is really not how to deal with things), and edited warred the article. Then after that to retaliate he put a deletion request on the shop=scooter article where he called me "a kind of troll" that "just likes to disturb a namespace based tagging scheme by inventing new shop types" and "probably a paid shill." There is someone who is right here, and it's not the person that deletes discussion other users comments or accuses users of being paid shills and calls them trolls. You can ask any established user (Jeisenbe, Dieterdreist, Mateusz Konieczny, Nakaner, Polarbearing, Woodpeck, etc) about RTFM. They will tell you he has continually caused problems for a few years now and that this just how he acts. If you want to continue making it about "both sides" or act like if I just hadn't had an opinion about tag that he'd be reasonable, even though he's had repeated issues with pretty much everyone, that's your prerogative. At the minimum id appreciate it if you at least told him not to insult other users or make false accusations about them. I asked him several times not to insult me anymore and he just called me a whiner. There's no level of being a called dumb, trollish, paid shill that should be acceptable. Not just because I don't like it, but also because it makes the platform look bad and the users come off as petty when those kinds of comments are everywhere. So, you could at least deal with that if your not wiling to put him in check about the other stuff. Although, you should totally deal with the other things also. --Adamant1 (talk) 02:31, 12 March 2020 (UTC)

Category:Eigenschaften > Category:DE:Eigenschaften

Guten Abend Tigerfell! Ich hatte die tolle Idee, die Seite Category:Eigenschaften zu erstellen (da sehr viele Seiten bereits auf diese als Gruppe verweisen) und die Kategorie dann nach Category:DE:Eigenschaften zu verschieben. - Leider hatte ich nicht so weit gedacht, dass der Inhalt der Kategorie-Seite gar kein eigentlicher Seiteninhalt ist, der mitverschoben wird. Somit hat mein "Umbenennungs-Trick" nicht hingehauen. - Da ich bislang im Forum auch nichts gelesen habe, was mir weiterhilft, habe ich die Hoffnung, das Du mir vielleicht sagen kannst, ob es die Möglichkeit gibt, den Kategorie-Inhalt doch noch zu verschieben oder die Original-Seite umzubenennen. (Ich habe deshalb jetzt erst einmal keine weiteren Veränderungen an den Seiten unternommen oder etwas rückgängig gemacht). - Falls es nicht geht, müsste ich wohl alle aufgelisteten verknüpften Seiten bearbeiten bzw. speichern, so dass die Gruppen-Verknüpfung auf die neue Seite (DE:Eigenschaften) hergestellt wird. Ist das korrekt? - Ich war etwas zu schnell und hätte besser erst fragen sollen, tut mir leid! Gruß, Chris --Chris2map (talk) 18:44, 1 April 2020 (UTC)

Hallo, der Fall ist tatsächlich etwas kompliziert, weil die Kategorisierung durch die Vorlage KeyDescription bzw. ValueDescription vorgenommen wird. Beide verfügen über einen Mechanismus, der beide Namen akzeptieren würde, aber die zweite Variante bevorzugen sollte. Hinzu kommt das Problem, dass das Wiki so eingestellt ist, dass Aktualisierungen von Weiterleitungen mit sehr niedriger Priorität erfolgen (s. und Bevor ich etwas geändert habe, war daher auf den Wiki-Seiten bereits die neue Kategorie eingetragen, nur die Kategorieseiten wurden nicht aktualisiert. Im ersten Schritt habe ich die Weiterleitung entfernt und den Wiki-Cache der alten Kategorie gelöscht. Das hat nicht sofort Abhilfe geschaffen, daher habe ich die alte Kategorie entfernt (Löschungen haben eigentlich eine höhere Priorität). Als letzte Option habe ich noch einen Null-Edit auf den kategorisierten Seiten ausgeführt. Das Verfahren aktualisiert die interne Link-Tabelle und hat bei mir zum gewünschten Effekt geführt. Als Nebenwirkung haben jetzt alle Beobachtenden der Seiten eine Nachricht erhalten.
Die Antwort lautet folglich "ja", möglicherweise hätte auch eine der von mir beschriebenen Alternativen mit etwas warten ausgereicht, ich war nur zu ungeduldig. 10:05, 2 April 2020 (UTC)
Vielen Dank für Deine Hilfe und die Erklärungen! Null-Edit habe ich gemeint mit "bearbeiten bzw. speichern". Wusste gar nicht, dass das eine offizielle Funktion ist. --Chris2map (talk) 21:00, 2 April 2020 (UTC)

Löschen von Seiten von Gebietskörperschaften

Vielen Dank, dass du meine Löschanträge für die Seiten von Gebietskörperschaften zeitnah abarbeitest.
Bei einigen Seiten hast du bemängelt, dass es noch Seiten gebe, die darauf verlinken. Prinzipiell stimme ich dir zu, dass eine zu löschende Seite von nirgendwo her mehr verlinkt sein sollte. Die Gebietskörperschaftsseiten werden oft jedoch von Listen-Seiten und den Seiten ihrer Nachbarn verlinkt (z.B. Germany/Landkreise verlinkt auf alle Kreise, Kreis A verlinkt auf seinen Nachbarkreis B). Wenn ich für jeden Löschkandidaten die Links aus den Listenseiten und den Nachbarseiten entfernen müsste, hätte ich mehr zu tun. Dabei sind die Links auf den Nachbarseiten meist in Abschnitten zu finden, die dann herausfliegen würden, wenn ich die Nachbarseite selbst einer Überarbeitung/Ausmistung unterziehen würde.
Verstehst du jetzt, warum ich noch existierende Links manchmal ignoriere? --Nakaner (talk) 10:56, 11 April 2020 (UTC)

Ja, das habe ich mir einige Zeit nach meinem Kommentar gedacht. Ich versuche zu überprüfen, ob die verbleibenden Informationen nach einer Löschung noch zusammenhängend wären. Theoretisch müssten irgendwann alle Seiten überarbeitet sein und dann könnte man die Löschanträge gebündelt prüfen oder sehe ich das falsch? 11:21, 11 April 2020 (UTC)
Ja, du kannst die Löschanträge auch gebündelt prüfen. Es ist dir überlassen, wie du dir die Arbeit einteilst. Ob es sich um eine Gebietskörperschaft handelt, kannst du ja am Namen der Seite i.d.R. erkennen. (Es gibt noch ein paar andere Bereiche, wo ich ausmiste, aber diese gehen zahlenmäßig unter) --Nakaner (talk) 11:23, 11 April 2020 (UTC)

Recreation of protected article

Hello. It appears that RTFM just recreated the same article that you protected with Motorcyle_namespace instead of resolving the issue with the protected one. It is essentially a copy of the other article, just under a different title. I'd like to see some kind of reprimand for it. As it's not an OK way to deal with things. BTW, he's also edit warring on the shop=motorcycle article again by trying to add back a table and tags that the consensus by multiple was against him adding. I'd appreciate it if you also dealt with that so the article can be preserved how the community wants it, without the table and without tags being listed that have little use. Thanks. --Adamant1 (talk) 18:55, 14 April 2020 (UTC)

Your message

I'll try to be mindful of your message on my talk page. Since I don't feel it's possible to not edit something that might have been edited by RTFM at some point, I'll probably just take a few months off from editing the wiki. I'm extremely saddened and disappointed that I am fall guy for his bad behavior. Especially considering the unfair accusations that I was targeting him and you never took any action on his abusive language etc toward me or him doing other things that were way worse then I did (at least not that I know of). Such is life though. I you know are working with what details you have and are dealing with the situation the best way your able to. So, I'm not faulting for it. Also, I wish the consensus on the things that where discussed mattered more then just appeasing a bully. I don't put that on you either though. The quickest way to two points is a straight and solving things with someone like RTFM who can't even deal with basic interactions appropriately definitely wouldn't be a straight line. So, I'm fine taking one for the team for the sake of civility. A lot of people thanked me for the edits I did that you take issue with. So, I at least know your way of dealing with it is in the fringe and how the community wants it to be resolved. Anyway, maybe you could do me a favor and ping me in two months to let me know the time is up. Since it's extremely doubtful I'll be on here much to check. --Adamant1 (talk) 23:18, 16 April 2020 (UTC)

Tigerfell, I have zero problem not commenting on his stuff if the dame rule applies to him. Otherwise, its just one sided. It doesnt help if you tell me not to edit his stuff or post in his discussions and then he does those to me. Like he did after you wrote me the message. Which is one of the reasons I responded the way I did. Its massively unfair to me if he can still harrase me and I cant respond and you dont do anything about it except scold me. Saying not to alter his changes is extremely vague though. I have every right to edit the Wiki without having to be paranoid that I will accidentally make an edit that will get me banned. So id appreciate it if you at least explained what exactly that means. If I do something like edit an article to add a word and it sends something he edited to a new line that would be altering his changes. So I really have no what your talking about. If your trying to pigen hole me into not being able to edit by being vague as crap and creating a standard I have no way to follow, just own up to it and ban me for a few months. Otherwise, be specific about it so I can actually do the right thing and put RTFM in the same box so it's fair and not one sided. If you don't it will just embolden him when the two months is over and I go back to editing. Plus, it will give him cart blaunch to screw with my edits while I'm gone. Which will cause more problems in the long run. So, please be clear about what you mean and make him follow the same standard. --Adamant1 (talk) 11:51, 17 April 2020 (UTC)


Tigerfell, see Tag:service=parts where RTFM reverted my edited that listed all the possible options tagging services (which was the correct way to do it) in favor of just namespaces. Also see the pages he created here, Tag:service=dealer, Tag:service=tyres,Tag:service=tyres. Where he created articles for service tags, and then didn't put anything about the tags or the actual alternatives. Except to assert his personal opinion that namespace are more precise and list a bunch of namespace tags that don't have proposals and almost zero usage. Wiki articles should be about the tag, not based on personal opinions, and list the alternatives. Those are exactly the kinds none neutral, one sided edits that cause these problems in the first place. As is him whitewashing any mentions of alternatives to namespace tags and deleting my edits like he did on Tag:service=parts. I'm not sure how I can be accused of targeting when I never removed mentions of namespaces from any article, but then somehow him deleting anything that's not a namespace from articles repeatedly (my edits or not) isn't.

Him deleting my edits and continuing the behaviors that caused the problems in the first place is exactly what happens when only one side is blocked from making certain edits, but the other isn't. It just emboldens the none blocked user. Especially in this case where his edits and behavior where clearly problematic to start with. You told me it doesn't matter if his edits were right or wrong, I should just leave them alone. The same should go for him and then he should also leave mine alone. He shouldn't be creating bias, one sided articles full of his personal opinions either. Otherwise, the problems will just continue in 2 months when I restore my edits that he targeted and make the articles neutral again.

It's not just a personal problem with me anyway. He's still having the same problems with Jeisenbe that he did with me. As you can see here, here, and here. Where in the last few days he has insulted Jeisenbe and dismissed his opinions. When Jeisenbe was being pretty reasonable. There's plenty of other examples. Probably those and the other edits are because he feels embolden now by the lack of consequences for his actions toward me. Do you really want to embolden and not deal with someone who acts and edits things the way he does (if I had anything to do with it originally or not)? Do you think the Wiki (or OSM) would be better if most of the articles where just glorified lists of low usage non-proposed namespace tags or the vast majority of talk pages where full of personal accusations and insults? Because that's how it's going to be if he isn't put in check. --Adamant1 (talk) 22:00, 20 April 2020 (UTC)

This page has been labelled for deletion

Because i made an error, i transfered all contents. Good pratice should be to put myself this ? {{D|page blanked by creator}} --Vinber (talk) 08:57, 22 April 2020 (UTC)

Yes, please. When you add this template the page will be added to Category:Labelled for deletion, too. The Administrators regularly check the content of this category. 08:53, 25 April 2020 (UTC)

Cookieeater1 damage

Can you delete Module:Infobox and other useless pages created by this user? See BTW, Category:Labelled for deletion started to overfill again. Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 23:15, 29 April 2020 (UTC)

I can have a look at that later. I usually run through that category about every second week. However, many candidates do not qualify for deletion. I will probably remove the template and comment on their talk pages. 09:56, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
Yes, I am not asking for a blind deletion (I was not reviewing because someone with deletion rights would need to review before deleting anyway) Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 11:26, 1 May 2020 (UTC)
I deleted the module page, since you can not use Template:Delete on it. I examined most of the deletion candidates and deleted 85 of them. Please note that there are currently many candidates which just came in recently (I usually wait 30 days before deleting them) and almost 1/3 originate from a recent conflict, hence I am not keen to delete them until the situation has settled a bit. 12:59, 2 May 2020 (UTC)

Wikidata link unfun

Is there a chance that you will look at Template_talk:Description#Remove_wikidata_from_this_template? There was discussion, with something that looks to me as a consensus decision, with tiny minority opposing. But single person who opposed claims that there is no consensus and that changes can not be made.

Can you make a sanity check? I am pretty sure that I am right, but it started to descend into edit war (depending on how you define it one or more people already started an edit war).

If you are unable to do it for some reason, please let me know and I will try to think for some other way to break deadlock (I am not happy about liberum veto attempt, but edit war would not be a solution) Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 09:54, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

I already noticed that and I am currently reading the statements. --Tigerfell This user is member of the wiki team of OSM (Let's talk) 09:57, 11 May 2020 (UTC)
Thanks! I hope that it can be resolved well. I wonder whatever I should ask for outside help a bit earlier Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 10:16, 11 May 2020 (UTC)
IMHO I would have asked for a 3rd person's opinion before suggesting to block a user involved. 11:22, 11 May 2020 (UTC)

More personal attacks by RTFM

So, RTFM is continuing to discuss and make accusations about me on his talk page. I have nothing to do with the problems he's having with other users and I'm tired of him trying to re-instigate things with me. Especially since I was the one blamed for targeting him. Yet I've been leaving his articles alone. While he's putting his problems with other users on me and accusing me of things. I'd appreciate it if you dealt with it. Since I can't respond to him or defend myself. Plus, you told him not talk about me to anyone, I got blocked for doing the same thing, and he's already been blocked once for it. He needs to get it this time and stop discussing me, or there will just keep being problems. Thanks. --Adamant1 (talk) 11:42, 14 May 2020 (UTC)

@Tigerfell: See Motorcyle tag overview and amenity=music_venue. With amenity=music_venue the consensus on the talk page was to add live_music to a "see also" section. Since it's not a synonym of music venue. Which he refused to do himself and edit warred my attempts to. There is also his revert on trailer:type. Although he created the article, it would still fall within the range of articles that caused problems in the first place and therefore him editing when I'm not allowed to be seen as trying to instigate things with me. Especially the revert on amenity=music_venue which is directly reverting my edit and when it was discussed. But also the revert to Motorcyle tag overview. Since you had to lock it and he was suppose to discuss it on the talk page and deal with the problems brought up there. His way of solving things by not discussing them, or insulting people, then waiting for awhile and just reverting people isn't the way to go about it. I can guarantee there will just be more problems on the 16th when I can edit articles again if he's not reprimanded in the meantime and continues to not do things the civil way. I'm not going through this again, but I'm not going to let him just revert my edits (especially ones that have consensus with other users) or go back to edit warring/insulting me like he's still doing even when he was told not to either. Hopefully you deal with him in the meantime so there won't just be more problems. --Adamant1 (talk) 13:13, 4 June 2020 (UTC)

Where can I ask for review on en-ja translation ?

Hi, I have translated the rest of the page, and wish to know how I can ask for review. Would you kindly point me to maybe a Village Pump type of page? I usually work on enwiki-jawiki, and wish to translate some pages so that to support WikiTowns projects. Cheers, --Omotecho 22:58, 18 June 2020 (UTC)

Thank you for the translation. There is a kind of a village pump page at Talk:Wiki. I am not sure if there are users who can speak Japanese. Maybe, you should send a message to This is a Japanese-speaking community mailing list. Alternatively, you can ask wiki users directly. There are language categories like Category:Users en ja-3 (native English speakers who speak proficient Japanese), Category:Users ja en-2 (native Japanese speakers who speak intermediate English), and Category:Users ja en-3 (native Japanese speakers who speak proficient English). I guess the simplest option is the mailing list. --10:39, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
Mind to subscribe the mailing list before you send your email. Postings by non-members of the mailing list are usually discarded and not forwarded to the members because they are almost always spam. --Nakaner (talk) 12:59, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
You can also look for other Japan community channels at Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 14:43, 19 June 2020 (UTC)
Tigerfell, Nakaner, Mateusz Konieczny Thank you indeed for thorough instructions, now I have better mapped to go forward. Cheers, --Omotecho 11:32, 21 June 2020 (UTC)


Hello. Are you able to install templates? If so, can you install the Columns-list template or at least point me in the direction of where I can go to get it installed? Thanks. --Adamant1 (talk) 12:49, 20 June 2020 (UTC)

I could import Template:Columns-list. Long lists like the ones on Germany/Landkreise seem to use a simplified syntax wrapping the relevant text in <div style="{{Column-width|18em}}"> and </div>. Does that work in your case, too? --10:38, 21 June 2020 (UTC)

Can you help with another opinion..

User:Hungerburg is getting a little heated over a non-issue ( , Talk:Key:sac_scale. The text in the page was there for pretty long and discussion with Hungerburg seems to lead nowhere. I would agree to revert the page to the state as described in the proposal but consider the other additions ("please consult printed guides, experienced guides or, as a last resort, well-established forums") by the user ill fated. Also, the text did nowhere say that sac_scale is a troll tag - it said that it is not a good example to design new tags by today's OSM standards. It was some other user who previously added a non-verifiable warning there and other users and me merely edited this to prevent more damage. I am not at all a fan of non-verfiable stickers but it should be mentioned in the page that there may be a problem.

Also, I have a big problem with the manners of that user. RicoZ (talk) 21:48, 20 June 2020 (UTC)

Hello Tigerfell, Hungerburg here: This is not a none-issue. This is about a long established key that is used by many "apps" as it is rightfully considered useful in describing certain conditions that are of interest for hikers.

Two years ago RicoZ changed the page mentioned above to make it read something completely different from what it has been for ten years then. Eg. he advised mappers to use this tag to prevent routers from sending unsuspecting pedestrians on any paths anywhere, while the approved proposal meant this tag only to be used on hiking trails. He wrote that into the head of the page, where it cannot be overlooked, although it contradicted long standing so called "suggestions" below the fold, that only did repeat the proposal.

In a section "controversies" he also stated that "many mappers consider this … a troll tag", which is not a nice thing to say about an approved and long established key, that is considered very helpful. For someone who acts like the custodian, I would not expect such.
In his complaint here, he parrots the words that I used against his trolling: I restate, he has no manners in discussing. Please read the discussion there, it has some more detail, and get at your opinion. --Hungerburg (talk) 22:30, 20 June 2020 (UTC)

Hi Hungerburg, you may be missing some history. It was User Xxzme (or whatever his username was) who introduced a big fat verifiability warning on top of that page. I did not like that and moved that down the page and added the comments about troll tag. However at the time it happened there was consensus in the mailing list that this tag is not verifiable and should have never been approved in the first place. RicoZ (talk) 20:36, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

Hello Tigerfell, I do not fully understand, why and what for you got involved. This is just to say, that the article SAC_scale has been overhauled by a third party. I have no issues with the article there as it is now. So this section here looks outdated to me. --Hungerburg (talk) 11:06, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
@RicoZ: I reviewed the comments and the changes on Key:sac_scale. As the cited sentence was removed meanwhile and the section about verification was added, I do not see any need to act on my side anymore. --11:52, 21 June 2020 (UTC)
Can you please sign correctly whoever you are? RicoZ (talk) 20:36, 11 July 2020 (UTC)

RTFM - help requested - RFTM wants page to describe his preferred tagging scheme rather than how industrial=fish_farm is present in the database.

For example he keeps adding "Add industrial=fish_farm to the respective feature, usually a building." while this tag is used all 8 times worldwide, never on a building.

When asked simple questions on talk page Talk:Tag:industrial=fish farm ("RTFM, have you seen how this tag is used? It appears that in basically all cases more standard landuse=aquaculture should be used instead.") he answers with links to and bizarre collection of stuff on

Mateusz Konieczny (talk) 08:51, 9 November 2020 (UTC)